La Fe consiste en confiar en una posibilidad que no sabes realmente si es cierta o no.
El razonamiento te lleva a no aceptar una posibilidad como verdadera hasta que ésta haya sido demostrada, y aun así, reflexionar sobre el resultado y desconfiar de él.
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Priority="65" SemiHidden="false" UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Medium List 1 Accent 6"/> <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="66" SemiHidden="false" UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Medium List 2 Accent 6"/> <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="67" SemiHidden="false" UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Medium Grid 1 Accent 6"/> <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="68" SemiHidden="false" UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Medium Grid 2 Accent 6"/> <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="69" SemiHidden="false" UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Medium Grid 3 Accent 6"/> <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="70" SemiHidden="false" UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Dark List Accent 6"/> <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="71" SemiHidden="false" UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Colorful Shading Accent 6"/> <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="72" SemiHidden="false" UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Colorful List Accent 6"/> <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="73" SemiHidden="false" UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Colorful Grid Accent 6"/> <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="19" SemiHidden="false" UnhideWhenUsed="false" QFormat="true" Name="Subtle Emphasis"/> <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="21" SemiHidden="false" UnhideWhenUsed="false" QFormat="true" Name="Intense Emphasis"/> <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="31" SemiHidden="false" UnhideWhenUsed="false" QFormat="true" Name="Subtle Reference"/> <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="32" SemiHidden="false" UnhideWhenUsed="false" QFormat="true" Name="Intense Reference"/> <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="33" SemiHidden="false" UnhideWhenUsed="false" QFormat="true" Name="Book Title"/> <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="37" Name="Bibliography"/> <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="39" QFormat="true" Name="TOC Heading"/> </w:LatentStyles> </xml><![endif]--><!--[if gte mso 10]> <style> /* Style Definitions */ table.MsoNormalTable {mso-style-name:"Tabla normal"; mso-tstyle-rowband-size:0; mso-tstyle-colband-size:0; mso-style-noshow:yes; mso-style-priority:99; mso-style-qformat:yes; mso-style-parent:""; mso-padding-alt:0cm 5.4pt 0cm 5.4pt; mso-para-margin-top:0cm; mso-para-margin-right:0cm; mso-para-margin-bottom:10.0pt; mso-para-margin-left:0cm; line-height:115%; mso-pagination:widow-orphan; font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"; mso-ascii-font-family:Calibri; mso-ascii-theme-font:minor-latin; mso-fareast-font-family:"Times New Roman"; mso-fareast-theme-font:minor-fareast; mso-hansi-font-family:Calibri; mso-hansi-theme-font:minor-latin;} </style> <![endif]--> La fe es confianza tal cual Gabriel, la confianza se coloca en algo que nos resulta verdadero cuando este “algo” pasa los parámetros de validación de conocimientos que cada persona tiene.
Para una persona es suficiente que su padre le diga que Dios existe. Para otra se necesita evidencia científica. Para otra con que sea razonable su existencia es suficiente.
Por otro lado, el razonamiento no te lleva necesariamente a no aceptar una posibilidad hasta que esta sea demostrada verdadera, también puede llevarte a aceptar una posibilidad si esta resulta lógica y coherente para la persona.
Entonces solo es razonamiento a medias.
El problema de esto es que el razonamiento es un concepto que se entremezcla con sabiduría, y cada uno tiene su propia concepción de lo que es eso. Una vez más el lenguaje nos impide llegar a un acuerdo. Para mi la lógica está en no aceptar ninguna posibilidad hasta que puedo aplicarla en la práctica.
Razon y lógica son sinónimos o pseudosinónimos, y para cada persona es lo lógico lo que quiere creer que es lógico, así que no llegaremos a ninguna parte.
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Priority="65" SemiHidden="false" UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Medium List 1 Accent 6"/> <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="66" SemiHidden="false" UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Medium List 2 Accent 6"/> <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="67" SemiHidden="false" UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Medium Grid 1 Accent 6"/> <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="68" SemiHidden="false" UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Medium Grid 2 Accent 6"/> <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="69" SemiHidden="false" UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Medium Grid 3 Accent 6"/> <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="70" SemiHidden="false" UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Dark List Accent 6"/> <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="71" SemiHidden="false" UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Colorful Shading Accent 6"/> <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="72" SemiHidden="false" UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Colorful List Accent 6"/> <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="73" SemiHidden="false" 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mso-tstyle-rowband-size:0; mso-tstyle-colband-size:0; mso-style-noshow:yes; mso-style-priority:99; mso-style-qformat:yes; mso-style-parent:""; mso-padding-alt:0cm 5.4pt 0cm 5.4pt; mso-para-margin-top:0cm; mso-para-margin-right:0cm; mso-para-margin-bottom:10.0pt; mso-para-margin-left:0cm; line-height:115%; mso-pagination:widow-orphan; font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"; mso-ascii-font-family:Calibri; mso-ascii-theme-font:minor-latin; mso-fareast-font-family:"Times New Roman"; mso-fareast-theme-font:minor-fareast; mso-hansi-font-family:Calibri; mso-hansi-theme-font:minor-latin;} </style> <![endif]--> No precisamente, razón es hilar ideas y conceptos para llegar a una conclusión, nada mas, así, decir:
Dios existe sin existir.
No es lógico, pero es un pensamiento producto de la razón, es decir, es razonable.
La lógica también es producto de la razón, pero esta trata de establecer reglas al acto de discurrir en nuestras mentes a fin de llegar a conclusiones validas y verdaderas.
Por tanto, creer en Dios es razonable (creemos en el porqué podemos siquiera pensar en el) y es lógico (podemos apelar a su existencia siguiendo las reglas de la lógica).
Lo que un creyente hasta hoy no puede decir, es que tiene una forma de probar que Dios existe sin dejar un lugar a dudas.
Entonces podemos decir que es una logica cutre pero es logica a fin de cuentas, es lo que quieres decir, ¿no?
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mso-tstyle-rowband-size:0; mso-tstyle-colband-size:0; mso-style-noshow:yes; mso-style-priority:99; mso-style-qformat:yes; mso-style-parent:""; mso-padding-alt:0cm 5.4pt 0cm 5.4pt; mso-para-margin-top:0cm; mso-para-margin-right:0cm; mso-para-margin-bottom:10.0pt; mso-para-margin-left:0cm; line-height:115%; mso-pagination:widow-orphan; font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"; mso-ascii-font-family:Calibri; mso-ascii-theme-font:minor-latin; mso-fareast-font-family:"Times New Roman"; mso-fareast-theme-font:minor-fareast; mso-hansi-font-family:Calibri; mso-hansi-theme-font:minor-latin;} </style> <![endif]--> Pues eso depende de tu interpretación de cómo DEBE ser la lógica, porque para mí es lógico completamente en el sentido de que no viola ninguna ley de la lógica y por medio de estas podemos llegar a la conclusión de que dicho ser existe.
Evidencia no es igual a lógica. No hay evidencia de que Dios exista, pero si es razonable y lógico pensar que existe.
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Interpretar arbitrariamente una de ellas como la verdad es Fe.
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mso-tstyle-rowband-size:0; mso-tstyle-colband-size:0; mso-style-noshow:yes; mso-style-priority:99; mso-style-qformat:yes; mso-style-parent:""; mso-padding-alt:0cm 5.4pt 0cm 5.4pt; mso-para-margin-top:0cm; mso-para-margin-right:0cm; mso-para-margin-bottom:10.0pt; mso-para-margin-left:0cm; line-height:115%; mso-pagination:widow-orphan; font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"; mso-ascii-font-family:Calibri; mso-ascii-theme-font:minor-latin; mso-fareast-font-family:"Times New Roman"; mso-fareast-theme-font:minor-fareast; mso-hansi-font-family:Calibri; mso-hansi-theme-font:minor-latin;} </style> <![endif]--> No es “mas” razonable, es igual de razonable y lógico, mas aun bajo la propuesta del teísta.
Sin embargo, tienes razón, el teísta a una posibilidad lógica y razonable le aplica toda su confianza y para ello también tiene argumentos.
Vaya, que ni el teísmo ni el ateísmo ni el agnosticismos son irracionales o ilógicos, todos están en las mismas y todos tienen fe en algo.
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Priority="65" SemiHidden="false" UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Medium List 1 Accent 6"/> <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="66" SemiHidden="false" UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Medium List 2 Accent 6"/> <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="67" SemiHidden="false" UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Medium Grid 1 Accent 6"/> <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="68" SemiHidden="false" UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Medium Grid 2 Accent 6"/> <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="69" SemiHidden="false" UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Medium Grid 3 Accent 6"/> <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="70" SemiHidden="false" UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Dark List Accent 6"/> <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="71" SemiHidden="false" UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Colorful Shading Accent 6"/> <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="72" SemiHidden="false" UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Colorful List Accent 6"/> <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="73" SemiHidden="false" 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mso-tstyle-rowband-size:0; mso-tstyle-colband-size:0; mso-style-noshow:yes; mso-style-priority:99; mso-style-qformat:yes; mso-style-parent:""; mso-padding-alt:0cm 5.4pt 0cm 5.4pt; mso-para-margin-top:0cm; mso-para-margin-right:0cm; mso-para-margin-bottom:10.0pt; mso-para-margin-left:0cm; line-height:115%; mso-pagination:widow-orphan; font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"; mso-ascii-font-family:Calibri; mso-ascii-theme-font:minor-latin; mso-fareast-font-family:"Times New Roman"; mso-fareast-theme-font:minor-fareast; mso-hansi-font-family:Calibri; mso-hansi-theme-font:minor-latin;} </style> <![endif]--> Yo no veo incompatibilidad entre fe y razón, no son lo mismo, pero no son excluyentes para nada.
La fe es la confianza que se deposita en razones y es extraño que un creyente diga “no” a esto, más aun cuando toda la biblia es un conjunto de razones y es de allí de donde los cristianos nutrimos la fe.
Uno no pone su confianza en algo que no conoce y para conocer hay que razonar, así, si creo en Dios es porque lo conozco y si lo conozco es porque razone para conocerlo, simple y sencillo.
Más bien la batalla es entre evidencia y fe teísta, no entre razón y fe….y aun así, evidencia y fe teísta son incompatibles circunstancialmente, pues no hay una razón lógica para decir que son mutuamente excluyentes.
Esa afirmación no se sostiene, spalatin.Spalatin [QUOTE dijo:Evidencia no es igual a lógica. No hay evidencia de que Dios exista, pero si es razonable y lógico pensar que existe.
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No precisamente, razón es hilar ideas y conceptos para llegar a una conclusión, nada mas, así, decir:
Dios existe sin existir.
No es lógico, pero es un pensamiento producto de la razón, es decir, es razonable.
La lógica también es producto de la razón, pero esta trata de establecer reglas al acto de discurrir en nuestras mentes a fin de llegar a conclusiones validas y verdaderas.
Por tanto, creer en Dios es razonable (creemos en el porqué podemos siquiera pensar en el) y es lógico (podemos apelar a su existencia siguiendo las reglas de la lógica).
Lo que un creyente hasta hoy no puede decir, es que tiene una forma de probar que Dios existe sin dejar un lugar a dudas.
Razón no es lo mismo que razonar.
Afirmar algo no es razonar. "Dios existe sin existir" es una frase, no un razonamiento.
La razón es la capacidad del ser humano para razonar.
Razonar es construir un razonamiento lógico. Si no conduce a una certeza, será un razonamiento falso.
Hilvanar frases sin sentido lógico, no es razonar en modo alguno, aunque las diga un ser racional.
Por ejemplo: "Hoy es de día porque he visto una gaviota ya que a mi hijo no le gusta el arroz". Nadie con sentido común llamaría esas frases un razonamiento.
En cambio, si dicen: Todas las mujeres morenas de ojos verdes son buenas, porque mi abuela era buena y tenía los ojos verdes y era morena; pues es un razonamiento lógico, pero no conduce a una certeza, luego cualquier razonamiento lógico no vale para concluir que lo que argumenta es cierto.